Mike/RFC:
We got Scott from Harmless Records here in the studios with
us tonight. He is the man in charge, the man with the plan
behind Harmless. Scott, what did we just hear?
Scott:
So what is this plan thing youre talking about?
Mike/RFC:
You know, you got the plan.
Scott:
Alright, if you say so.
Mike/RFC:
You better have a plan.
Scott:
That was some old, old Harmless stuff. A band called My
Foolish Halo and thats their track off of a 1995 compilation
that we put out called Dad, Are We Punk Yet?
The song is called What Is Shame?
Mike/RFC:
If I remember right, was that the first full length album
that you released?
Scott:
Yeah, that was the first full length release that Harmless
put out.
Mike/RFC:
How exactly did Harmless get its start. That record
being your first full length album it was still your 7th
release at the time. Tell us a little bit about the early
days of Harmless Records.
Scott:
Back then in Chicago, everything was still demos and 7s.
Not a whole lot of bands put out albums really, except for
the bigger ones. What Im saying is that back then
it wasnt unusual to have a punk label be around and
have 10 releases and have 8 of them be eps. How I
got the label started though. I was in a band called Chemical
Blue in 1992.
Mike/RFC:
I actually meant to bring the 7 in tonight and sneak
attack you with it.
Scott:
Its funny. If you really want to, you can play the
Chemical Blue track off of Dad, Are We Punk Yet?
Mike/RFC:
I was actually going to play Toad.
Scott:
Ah, even better. Thats alright, listen to Justins
show on Friday night. He plays it all the time. Everytime
I call in hes got it waiting to antagonize me. Anyways,
to say the least, its 10 years old and not that good.
So yeah, I was in a band called Chemical Blue and we wanted
to put out a record. We had this local label lined up to
try and help us out, but they ran into some financial trouble
and I really wanted to see it happen. I fronted the money
and worked it out and started selling the record and found
out that I really enjoyed doing this so I thought, Maybe
I should do some more records. Chemical Blue had saved
a couple songs to do a split 7 with somebody. Which
means one band on one side and one on the other, and we
found a band to do it with and I put it out and decided
to make that my new record labels first release. It
kind of went from there.
Mike/RFC:
How did you come up with the name?
Scott:
Theres no great dramatic story or anything. I was
just sitting there one day racking my brain trying to come
up with a name, cuz the first Chemical Blue 7, even
though I released it, had somebody elses name on it.
We thought the label was going to help us so we put their
name on the back of the cover and when it became clear that
the label would not recover from their financial problems
and Id be the one paying for it, it was too late.
So, it still had their name on the back of it. Even though
I paid for it and its kind of my labels first
release, it doesnt have my label name anywhere on
it. It doesnt say harmless anywhere on it. So, for
my second record, which was really my first, I wanted to
come up with a name and was just racking my brains and it
just sort of popped in there and I thought, Well,
Im not going to do any better than that.
Mike/RFC:
The name leaves itself open to a lot of junior high school
jokes. I just noticed that someone on your guestbook recently
left a pretty harsh message about the name. What are definitely
some of the funniest things youve heard about the
label?
Scott:
Actually, not as much as youd think. Just a lot of
really obvious puns on the name. When I started, it was
a punk rock label, and it still more or less is, but the
joke was oh yeah, Harmless records, and I was going to be
putting out the really visceral, aggressive sounding stuff.
But of course, whenever I put out anything thats the
slightest bit light or not heavy in any way and the reviewer
doesnt like it then they say, Oh yeah, Harmless
Records, this is really Harmless. Thats really as
creative as it gets. I admit, the name is a little juvenile,
and I would never put out a compilation nowadays called,
Dad, Are We Punk Yet? but, I was a lot younger
then. Ive been doing the label for about 10 years.
Mike/RFC:
Were going to get back into the music here. Well
be back with Scott but were going to play another
song that Scott put out. Tell us a bit about it.
Scott:
Its a band called Walker, another older one. This
was Harmless 16th release. I had put out a couple
45s for them and they actually made it to an album.
One of those few Chicago punk bands that made it to an album,
well, their really from Lafayette, IN.
Mike/RFC:
Why did people think they were a Chicago band for so long.
I mean, I grew up in Homewood and people from Homewood seriously
thought that they were from Homewood. There was a kid in
my high school that tried to find the house they lived in.
Scott:
Yeah, Homewood had quite a punk scene going on back then
and bands used to play there all the time and theyd
play at this place called Off The Alley and Lafayette, IN
is where Perdue University is, its about 2 and a half
hours from here. Homewood is about an hour south of Chicago
so Lafayette is right in between Homewood and Chicago.
Mike/RFC:
You mean Homewood is right in between the city and Lafayette.
Scott:
Yeah. I dont do radio that often, as you could tell.
Id be great doing this professionally. So yeah, Homewood
was right in between the two and it was a lot easier for
Walker to get shows in Homewood and they were a lot easier
for the band to get to. They played there so often that
a lot of area people just assumed they were from there.
(Go listen to your Walker CD right now)
Mike/RFC:
We are back. You are tuned into Radio Free Chicago on 88.7
and we got Scott Thomson here in the studio, the man in
charge of Harmless Records. Say Hi.
Scott:
Hi.
Mike/RFC:
Again.
Scott:
Again.
Mike/RFC:
We were talking a little bit earlier about the starting
of Harmless Records, how it sort of came about. Through
all that time, you must have come up with a direction for
the label. Where did you see the label going in the early
days and compare that to what you are trying to achieve
with the label now.
Scott:
When I first started out my only real agenda was to put
out records by Chicago bands that I liked. I never had a
real strict policy of sticking only to Chicago bands. It
kind of by default just ended up being that way. In the
early days those were the only bands that I had the opportunity
to approach. In the later days out of town bands would approach
me but for whatever reasons it just wouldnt work out.
I realized that I actually preferred to work in situations
where I could get to know the musicians fairly well and
go see them live on a regular basis and feel like I had
some sort of connection with them, whereas if I was working
with out of town bands Id only be able to see them
when they were on tour or if I made a special trip to their
town. Its still not an iron clad rule, but I still
work with 95% local bands. I also dont really stick
with just one sound. I just kind of like to try to document
some of what is going on in the city, that I like. Ill
be fair about that. I dont think I should do a record
for this band just cuz a lot of people like them and are
going to their shows if Im not into it. So I dont
try to stick to one sound and I dont go with something
that Im not into just because its popular. The
range of stuff Ive put out has really varied, partly
because what has been going on in the Chicago underground
scene has changed, but also because my tastes have changed
as well. Like a lot of the early records are very punk rock
or pop-punk and in the later records you get into more indie
rock or emo or really aggressive hardcore.
Mike/RFC:
Now your label definitely jumps around in sounds, you dont
narrow yourself into one genre, but you still have this
stigma over your head of being a pop-punk label. I know
its come up in talking to bands in the past. Why do
you think you have this and how has it affected you as a
label?
Scott:
Thats actually been beginning to change over the last
few years finally, but uhm, its pretty easy. When
I first started off, out of my first 6 or 7 records, the
ones that did really well were the pop-punk records. Winepress,
Walker, The Mushuganas. All of these were pretty poppy,
melodic records. And for every one of those there was a
kendokwan record, which was aggressive indie rock, a My
Foolish Halo 7 which is more abrasive. The other stuff
was in there the whole time. Its just the stuff that
caught on was the poppier stuff. A label can get itself
pigeonholed very quickly and it did take me a long time
to break out of that and since it wasnt something
I was going for I wasnt fully conscious of it, until
one day I was calling a record store. I was putting out
the Traitors 7, the first record from that band, who
are pretty aggressive hardcore punk band, and I was talking
to a record store about it and the guy said, Wow,
the Traitors. Isnt that pretty aggressive for Harmless?
And I said, Oh no, no, I like hardcore, what are you
talking about. Then I thought back and could totally
see how he got that impression. Then a couple years later
when I was trying to branch out more and more a band that
I would approach would say things like, But you run
a pop-punk label, and I would respond, I only
run a pop-punk label because bands like you give me that
answer. If you gave me a chance to do your record it wouldnt
be so much in one direction. But thats years
passed. I really think Ive smashed that mold. Not
that I was embarrassed of my past. It was simple, Pop-punk
had been around for a while and I had grown and matured
and wanted to branch out into other things. I got interested
in new bands and new sounds and new bands also started showing
up more in the Chicago scene.
Mike/RFC:
Youre talking about new bands and new sounds, but
one of your newest records is a discography CD by the band
Bhopal Stiffs, which is the oldest recordings that you put
out on the label, yet one of your newest releases. Tell
me about how that record happened and who the Bhopal Stiffs
are. Why did you feel the need for the record to come out
this much after the fact?
Scott:
Sure. The Bhopal Stiffs were and old Chicago punk band who
were around from 1985-1989. They put out a 10 song demo,
a 2 song 45 and a 6 song 12 EP. They were most known
for the EP, it was their last record. The reason people
were into them and were checking out their stuff was that
Larry Damore who sings for Pegboy and Steve Sailors who
was the first bass player for Pegboy played in Bhopal Stiffs
prior to Pegboy. Bhopal Stiffs were around for a long time.
They were pretty well known and pretty well liked for back
then. They did quite well in drawing crowds and all their
releases were long out of print and very hard to find. Theres
some releases that are out of print but enough were made
so its not that hard to find them, but Bhopal Stiffs
records were really hard to find. The way I got the idea,
I just love Chicago music and I have a great deal of interest
in the history of Chicago music. I have a great deal of
respect for the past and those that have done this before
me. I used to play in a band called The Letterbombs and
I was talking to our bass player, Rob, who also has a great
deal of respect for the old bands, and we were talking about
stuff we really liked and records that we wished would be
re-issued. I brought up the Bhopal Stiffs and he said it
was a great idea and that I should really look into doing
it. I did. It took me a while to track everyone down and
everything. The more I talked about it and talked to others
about it, the more I realized that other people were really
excited about it and wanted to hear the stuff as well. Either
they had never heard it and were curious about it because
they had heard the mention of the band. Oh, it was
two guys from Pegboy. I really want to check that out.
Either that or people that had heard the older records at
one point or had one record and not the other. You know,
there was enough of an interest in it. Even though it was
nothing like what I was doing at the time I still wanted
to release the stuff. Thats not that unusual. For
example, Touch And Go re-released the Effigies Remains
Not Viewable compilation. Thats some old Chicago
punk rock and they dont really put out records like
that anymore.
Mike/RFC:
But I think the difference is is that the Effigies had lbums
that came out and had more material that came out on a wider
scale than that of the Bhopal Stiffs. What was going on
in your head that convinced you that there was a definite
need for this? Also, what has the response been after the
record came out?
Scott:
Thats true. They definitely werent quite as
well known as the Effigies. I mean, a lot of older people
remember them, but with the younger crowd they werent
one of those bands, since their records were out of print,
that had their records handed down and were known about.
One record that really helped a lot that I have to give
credit to is an old Chicago 7 called Viva Chicago
which was a split 7 between 2 Chicago bands, The Bollweevils
and 88 Fingers Louie. Both bands each picked 2 old Chicago
punk bands to cover and 88FL chose the Bhopal Stiffs as
one of their bands and did a song called Not Just My Head.
This was sometime around 1993, 1994, and this was a lot
of kids first introduction to the band. I remember that
record coming out and really liking it and a lot of other
people that liked it I knew of and again, it was, Oh
this band is great. Where can I get their record?
you cant. So it was owhen the first idea came around.
Like I said before, the more I talked to people about this
record the more I found out that a surprising amount of
people remembered this band and wanted it to come out or
had heard about the band and wanted it to come out. The
response I got has been great. It sold well. I got a lot
of e-mails and letters from people who just wrote and said,
Thank you for making this available. Im 35 years
old now and I live in California. Im from Chicago
and I used to love going to see the Bhopal Stiffs and its
wonderful to have this CD so I can listen to this stuff.
Mike/RFC:
Well, I think we should play a track off the Bhopal Stiffs
CD !985-1989. What track are we going to hear?
Scott:
Its a track called Product of Society, actually, its
just called Product. Its off their 6 song EP entitled
E.P.A. The last record they put out. It was
put out long enough ago that there was no CD. Just vinyl.
Mike/RFC:
Was there a cassette version?
Scott:
Nope, no cassette version, although it was right in that
time
period.
(Go listen to Bhopal Stiffs sucka)
Mike/RFC:
OK, we are back with Scott Harmless as he has become known
around Chicago. We just played a set of all harmless stuff
starting out with the Bhopal stiffs which we talked about
earlier. After Bhopal stiffs we heard Dance and Destroy
with Mission control! Mission Control! From the Self-Titled
7.
Scott:
Yeah its actually a limited edition 7. Theres
300 copies of the record on two different colors of vinyl.
Mike/RFC:
Yeah, and right after that we heard the Wayouts. Better
days was the track and the EP that that was off of. You
actually played in that band, right?
Scott:
Yeah, I played guitar. That band has also been disbanded
for a couple years. We played live here on the station several
times and you guys played it a lot. WLUW was very supportive
of us.
Mike/RFC:
Then we heard Lying In States who was here live on the show
last week. The track was called People. Now, thats
your newest release, right?
Scott:
Yeah. Its off their 6-song Cdep called, The
Bewildered Herd. It comes out this week.
Mike/RFC:
The last song we just heard before coming back on the air
here was The Littleman Complex. That was an Untitled, unreleased
track from The Littleman Complex. Tell me a little bit about
that band. What is going on with them?
Scott:
Its the new band that I play in currently. We have
a 5-song 12/Cdep coming out in the next month or so.
Mike/RFC: Is
that track going to be on it?
Scott:
No, that song we havent quite figured out what we
are going to do with it yet. Its one of the newer
recordings.
Mike/RFC:
And youre putting that out?
Scott:
Yes.
Mike/RFC:
What are your thoughts about, well, Ive always fought
with this dilemma. Youre in a band. You do a record
label. Now if you release your own record, on one hand it
could make it seem not as important, like, Oh, he
had to do it himself because nobody else would, whereas
on the other hand if you do put it out it shows you have
enough confidence in your band to invest the time and money
into it. What are your thoughtson this?
Scott:
I guess, Ive never had a problem with it. Ive
never worried that people would think I was putting out
my own bands records because no one else would, well, maybe
with the Chemical Blue 7cuz it was true, but after
that I was fortunate enough to be in good enough bands where
that was never an issue. There was other people around who
had made offers to put out the stuff from the other bands.
A lot of the times the label I ran myself just happened
to be the best alternative. I mean, there was interest though.
You put out a record for my old band The Letterbombs. The
Wayouts were on a few comps and had interest shown in them.
The Littleman Complex, the same thing. Weve been on
some comps and have had offers to do records in the future.
I guess what Im saying is that enough people like
the bands that Ive been in that that doesnt
really bother me at all.
Mike/RFC:
The Littleman Complex is going to be your 39th release?
Scott:
Actually, its catalog number 35, but 37 and 38 are
out already. What happened was the Seven Days of Samsara
Never Stop Attacking CD and the Lying In States
Cdep both scheduled afterwards, but both bands went out
on tour this summer and The Littleman Complex was not able
to because of work schedules, so I pushed our record back
to get the touring bands records out so that they would
have a record to tour on. Only seems fair.
Mike/RFC:
Now youve been doing this for almost 10 years. Youve
put out almost 40 records and now, about 3 months ago you
announced to a bunch of people that you are quitting the
label. What happened?
Scott:
Nothing immediate and dramatic. It was just a slow process
of just kind of getting tired of it. You do something for
10 years and thats a long time to do something. Im
just not into it as much anymore. The nature of independent
record labels and independent music and punk rock has changed
a lot in 10 years and what it means to run an independent
label has changed a lot in 10 years and Im not saying
that everything that is going on now is bad. Nothing like
that. Its just that nowadays I feel that this climate
and everything just isnt really what I signed up for.
I still love music. I still love playing music. As far as
running a record company though, Im just not enjoying
it nearly as much as I used to.
Mike/RFC:
Is this a definite quit for good, or is this just a put
it on the back burner until I find inspiration?
Scott:
I should know better. I almost quit 2 years ago and told
a bunch of people and ended up changing my mind. I like
to leave myself a back door, but this time Im pretty
sure this is it. Im going to stop at least for a while.
Sometimes when you get so caught up in doing something and
youve been doing it for such a long time you really
need to take a step back and not do it and see how you feel
about it. Anything that takes a lot of devotion, like sports,
musicians, you hear about this all the time, and I guess
itd be safe
to say that thats what Im planning on doing.
Obviously I still have a couple of release coming up. I
have the Littleman Complex EP. I have a Harmless Records
7 box set of a bunch of the old 7s, so Ill
still finish those out, but Im not scheduling anything
new. At that point though things should be slowing down
and Ill see how I feel.
Mike/RFC:
Were gonna miss you Scott. We got another track from
the Harmless catalog coming up. This is Aluminum Origami
off the Nymb Glass Eye EP. Well be back
with Scott Thomson after this.
(Its now time for Nymb people)
Mike/RFC:
OK, we are back with Scott Harmless and instead of chatting,
were gonna get right back into another song. That
was just Nymb that we heard. Now Scott. Youve been
doing the label for a long time. You helped me start my
label by offering me helping advice. It seems that Chicago
almost has more labels than bands nowadays. What advice
can you give to someone out there starting a new label,
other than not to?
Scott:
Run Away!
Mike/RFC:
Yeah, just dont.
Scott:
Thats tough because that all depends. I think the
best advice is to just the best you can, be honest about
your goals and what you want to do with the label. I know
sometimes that goals change and you dont know exactly
where you want to go with it, but if youre really
trying to make some money and put your name on the map,
just admit it and be honest with yourself about it. If you
just want to release some records with some cool local bands
you need to approach it from a completely different viewpoint.
Its hard to have it both ways. So I guess the best
advice is to just be honest with yourself. Know why you
are doing it and pursue it that way.
Mike/RFC:
Can you explain the difference between releasing a record
and actually selling a record, cuz some people assume they
are one in the same and they really arent.
Scott:
Thats true. If you are in a band or do a label you
think about this sort of thing, but to most people its
like a book. They think of the author and the story and
not the publisher. Why would you, unless youre into
it? Releasing a record means you get the recordings, pay
for it, get it manufactured and the CDs show up at
your house. Actually selling a record takes an extra step.
You need to promote the record so people know it exists.
Send it to radio and magazines and get it in stores. Get
it into distributors and run ads. Hopefully if you do it
well and the band tours and hopefully it will sell well.
Ive known quite a few people who have put out really
good records by really good bands and the records have just
failed miserably. They havent been able to sell them
at all. I think theres also a perception out there
that if the music is really good it will eventually catch
on. Thats not always the case and its not fair.
Ask any record label guy and theyll tell you about
a great band that no one has ever heard of. Theres
a lot of factors that go into it. The band has to play a
lot, tour a lot, the label has to do a lot of promotion.
It all costs money. A lot of money, and unfortunately you
have to do this for people to know your record exists.
Mike/RFC:
Especially nowadays.
Scott:
Yeah, especially nowadays. It was easier 10 years ago. A
lot of my earlier releases sold better. There were less
labels back then.
Mike/RFC:
So final advice on the label thing would be to not do it?
Just dont do it.
Scott:
Ha ha ha ha.
Mike/RFC:
Well, Scott, we really appreciated having you in tonight.
Scott:
Thanks for having me, it was fun.
for more info on Harmless Records please
visit: www.harmlessrecords.com
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